Login

Couple of questions on NAT

Tips & tricks, working results, technical support

Couple of questions on NAT

Postby markrandallpixley » Tue Aug 05, 2014 10:16 am

First question is there a list of "preset" values for gear that I can examine? My problem arises when sampling a compressor and I want to use peak reduction, which is sort of an "AU' classification but not quite...what are the classifications on the multi page, (Au/ER/EA)...ratio and attack I can make the connection to but is AU "audio units" and what would peak reduction be?)

Second we went through the process of making a session, setting up everything and saving our work and when NAT finished it only created a .NV file and not a .NP file, so there is no way to test our efforts, why or how would it fail to create the program file but did make the vector file?

Thanks in advance.

-Mark
markrandallpixley
User Level I
User Level I
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 7:07 am

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby Support » Tue Aug 05, 2014 4:47 pm

First question is there a list of "preset" values for gear that I can examine? My problem arises when sampling a compressor and I want to use peak reduction, which is sort of an "AU' classification but not quite...what are the classifications on the multi page, (Au/ER/EA)...ratio and attack I can make the connection to but is AU "audio units" and what would peak reduction be?)


viewtopic.php?f=18&t=18837 + viewtopic.php?f=18&t=20387

Second we went through the process of making a session, setting up everything and saving our work and when NAT finished it only created a .NV file and not a .NP file, so there is no way to test our efforts, why or how would it fail to create the program file but did make the vector file?


Normally happens when you save your NAT session in a wrong path folder or you try to use a template from other (different) session. NAT will deconvolve your samples first and create N2V files then will collect all information and create the N2P file.
Best regards,
Enrique Silveti.
Acustica Audio customer and technical support
http://www.acustica-audio.com
User avatar
Support
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 2877
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:33 am
Location: Lodi, Lombardia, Italy.

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby markrandallpixley » Tue Aug 05, 2014 7:55 pm

Thanks for the reply, I will go through the linked tips to figure out the "peak reduction" setting...

Is there a way to deconolve and redo the samples without sitting and re-sampling each setting by using the audio files I've already created?

I guess I am asking if there is a way to reset the folders (ie: create a new compressor using the template and existing audio samples) and run the convolution so that it creates a program file (.NP)?
markrandallpixley
User Level I
User Level I
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 7:07 am

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby markrandallpixley » Tue Aug 05, 2014 8:41 pm

By the way we are sampling a LA3A, there is no release/attack, simply a "Peak reduction" and "Gain" switch...the peak reduction essentially works BOTH parameters at once based on where you set it...10 steps each for gain/peak reduction...
markrandallpixley
User Level I
User Level I
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 7:07 am

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby giancarlo » Wed Aug 06, 2014 3:58 pm

markrandallpixley wrote:Thanks for the reply, I will go through the linked tips to figure out the "peak reduction" setting...

Is there a way to deconolve and redo the samples without sitting and re-sampling each setting by using the audio files I've already created?

I guess I am asking if there is a way to reset the folders (ie: create a new compressor using the template and existing audio samples) and run the convolution so that it creates a program file (.NP)?


yes in offline tab you can do that... you should modify only the template though, or parameters located in the first tab of expert page (not the second one).
Anyway templates are not available directly to customers but to library developers. If you plan to get serious and become a 3rd party developers we can find a solution.
User avatar
giancarlo
Founder
Founder
 
Posts: 9163
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:40 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby giancarlo » Wed Aug 06, 2014 3:59 pm

markrandallpixley wrote:By the way we are sampling a LA3A, there is no release/attack, simply a "Peak reduction" and "Gain" switch...the peak reduction essentially works BOTH parameters at once based on where you set it...10 steps each for gain/peak reduction...



compressor sampling is not documented, and is not simple at all, plus we are upgrading to a new procedure. About the lacking of attack or release times don't worry, just sample a single attack and release
User avatar
giancarlo
Founder
Founder
 
Posts: 9163
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:40 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby jorismak » Wed Aug 06, 2014 9:45 pm

isn't the la3a a program-dependent release? Can that be sampled in Nebula?
jorismak
Member
Member
 
Posts: 344
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:49 am

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby giancarlo » Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:06 pm

yes it can
User avatar
giancarlo
Founder
Founder
 
Posts: 9163
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:40 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby markrandallpixley » Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:56 am

The LA3a is program dependent, it only has a gain and a peak reduction, 0-10 for each of them, I went through and sampled 1-7 on gain (more would have clipped and we set the sample at -18db because the unit has over 50 db of gain) and also sampled 0-10 on the peak reduction, I still have the files and even though we only recorded at 44.1 it is a very high end AD/Da unit and the La3a is incredibly quiet (noise floor below -90db)by the time I was at 7 gain and 8 peak reduction I started dialing in the gain a bit at each location to get a better saturation w/o clipping...program/vector files worked but there are no parameters in the program that I can set, so I need to go back and modify the program...

By the way we have run several professional studio's in California and Arizona and I can tell you now this program is not ready for prime time in a real studio, no engineer worth his salt is going to waste his time setting all these parameters.

Our gear is on several international grammy winning albums, so we are not novices here, I find the responses both superficial and elitist, sounds like you guys just make code and have not a clue how a real studio works.

I WAS interested in developing third party plug-ins, but it sounds like it is much more trouble than it is worth...after spending two entire days following vague and spotty instructions our efforts seem like wasted time now.
markrandallpixley
User Level I
User Level I
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 7:07 am

Re: Couple of questions on NAT

Postby giancarlo » Thu Aug 07, 2014 12:08 pm

ok I try to describe the situation, so you have a clear picture about it.

- at the moment we sell nebula, and we are trying to improve performances, workflow, formats and so on.

- we have an internal division for developing acqua plugins, our developers are skilled and talented also on sampling (and real studio situation). We are going to release many products. Sampling is not easily, it requires a lot of knowledge for getting a proper result

- we are shipping nat as tool for sampling, but it is pretty limited in the format actually distributed: it generates crypted files, and documentation is not very detailed. Luckily, there are impressive articles on magazines, ie Sound on Sound june and july, they are almost 20 pages, aimed to help non-programmers and people working in recording studio. Btw we started as musicians, not as programmes, we know how a studio works pretty well. Anyway beware, following those instructions you will sample successfully just simple units, not a compressor like a la3a. Compressor sampling is not even documented and we do NOT support users asking about them; sessions are there if you want to experiment, BUT we suggest to start from something simple, like a reverb or a preamp, we suggest to getting skills before going on
We have no interested in getting a sort of q-clone user, someone who samples his own gear. There are 20000 emulations arounds, the world doesn't need someone to sample again a pultec, we have already many. What is lacking is the "proper" sampling of something missing, and a "proper" sampling requires skills.


- we have a community composed by around 20 3rd party developers. Our community is well supported.Supporting them is a complex task and we pay huge efforts, even adding new developments when necessary. You need to enter the 3rd party developer program; it is a bit like entering avid 3rd party developers program, more or less. Those developers access tools, infos and tons of support. They ask things to my email directly, and we have a team able to help them in several ways.

- we are even doing free courses for 3rd party developers who are interested in a deep knowledge about sampling; we have first one around 2 months ago and we'll have next one around the beginning of september. They are aimed to musicians and producers, not developers. We don't spend much time on maths but we pay attention to real devices, sampling even a device they bring with them as a sort of test.


LAST BUT NOT LEAST

about compressors, like you maybe already know, actual sampling procedure is not perfect (not as much good and straightforward like sampling a preamp or an eq). Anyway we are already able to sample properly a la3a. We'll do it on next months. At the moment even 3rd party developers do not access our latest tools, but only our internal developers, because we are still improving... exactly compressors.
User avatar
giancarlo
Founder
Founder
 
Posts: 9163
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:40 pm
Location: Italy

Next

Return to Working with Nat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests