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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby babiuk » Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:40 am

I understand this is a so hard project and RJHollins did a very important work here, congratulations for it.

Anyway I don´t have so much time to try to understand the inner proccess who make it work. You are so kind for explaining it so well and teaching us about MIDI and nebula, but I think it would be clearer if we have a thread for "install the tool and use it" and another for "how it works really"(with all the info and knowledge about midi), so people could have the choice just to know how to use the tool and the choice to learn more about it.

I mean, I'm so happy with this wonderful tool and it change nebula workflow light years, but I think all the info mixed in the same place is a little confusing, or at least it takes a lot of time to follow

Well, just thoughts about it.
The real thing is you got a golden tool, RJHollins, thanks
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby Hannes_F » Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:46 am

RJHollins wrote:
So there is a MIDI learn feature in Reaper? Maybe that can help.


oh yes ... that is used to teach the BYPASS function as shown in the Reaper video.


Sorry, I misspelt that. I meant:

There is a MIDI learn function in Nebula! Manual page 22.

With that I am now able to have NVC to transfer information to Nebula.

However what is strange: The faders and values will only move when I double click the Nebula GUI. But the sound changes, and that is what counts.

@babjuk
The whole procedure in this thread here may then result into what you want, hopefully.
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby RJHollins » Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:59 am

HI babiuk,

Still flying around :lol: But I do understand what you're saying. I think it's the problem of this writer stepping back to give a user perspective. It sounds easy, but the output wants to go off the deepend [without warning] :shock: :lol:

If you'd like ... tell me at what point you're getting stuck. At the very least, it may help direct me on how/what to put into a tutorial.

Certain things will be very basic stuff.

Editing the Nebula main XML file to define the [CC] numbers is a onetime operation.

2. Making a custom Nebula [using Zab's SetUPs] is standard. Nothing specific needed for the NVC.

3. The NVC needs to be pointed [the first time] to the XML file made by Zab's program. This is usually in x:/nebulatemprepository/SETUPs folder. The NVC needs to load that specific file the first time only. Afterwards, the NVC takes care of itself.

Basically ... that's it.

The way things get routed in the various DAWs is where each is different. [That is why an 'chainer' like BIDULE or METAPlugin are so useful].

I'll be happy to try to help ... but I need to know where you've stopped at.

Hey ... this can help many users.
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby RJHollins » Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:02 am

Hannes_F wrote:
RJHollins wrote:
So there is a MIDI learn feature in Reaper? Maybe that can help.


oh yes ... that is used to teach the BYPASS function as shown in the Reaper video.


Sorry, I misspelt that. I meant:

There is a MIDI learn function in Nebula! Manual page 22.

With that I am now able to have NVC to transfer information to Nebula.

However what is strange: The faders and values will only move when I double click the Nebula GUI. But the sound changes, and that is what counts.

@babjuk
The whole procedure in this thread here may then result into what you want, hopefully.

Hi Hannes_F ...

Hey ... I'm going to follow along with your findings. Without doubt, there is more than one way to do all this. I cannot say that my way is the best or only.

If a simpler, better way is exposed ... or if I need to change the way the NVC operates ... that's fine.

I'm learning too 8-)
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby Hannes_F » Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:03 am

RJHollins wrote:.Be sure you have downloaded the latest Reaper support files that I posted on my site. Inside there you should see 'MIDItoReaControlPath_v1.0_x64.zip'. that is the 64-bit reported working.


Nope . . . I still see the old version on your site. However I was able to download it here
http://reaper.mj-s.com/MIDItoReaControl ... .0_x64.zip

I have Bidule too, would you share an example project?

Thanks, Hannes
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby RJHollins » Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:06 am

Hannes_F wrote:
RJHollins wrote:.Be sure you have downloaded the latest Reaper support files that I posted on my site. Inside there you should see 'MIDItoReaControlPath_v1.0_x64.zip'. that is the 64-bit reported working.


Nope . . . I still see the old version on your site. However I was able to download it here
http://reaper.mj-s.com/MIDItoReaControl ... .0_x64.zip

I have Bidule too, would you share an example project?

Thanks, Hannes


OK ... I'll recheck my site ... I thought I updated that ... i'll check.

Ah ... you have BIDULE ... I'll be glad to share the preset chain. Which NVC controller would you prefer to see it with?
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby RJHollins » Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:25 am

RJHollins wrote:
Hannes_F wrote:
RJHollins wrote:.Be sure you have downloaded the latest Reaper support files that I posted on my site. Inside there you should see 'MIDItoReaControlPath_v1.0_x64.zip'. that is the 64-bit reported working.


Nope . . . I still see the old version on your site. However I was able to download it here
http://reaper.mj-s.com/MIDItoReaControl ... .0_x64.zip

I have Bidule too, would you share an example project?

Thanks, Hannes


OK ... I'll recheck my site ... I thought I updated that ... i'll check.

Ah ... you have BIDULE ... I'll be glad to share the preset chain. Which NVC controller would you prefer to see it with?


---- EDIT ---

I've update the 'Reaper Stash' link. It indeed was missing the 64-bit version. My fault :oops: It is now included.

Also ... why the host cannot fix the filenames to be correct as I have them is beyond me :roll: I need to call tech support again about this. :evil:
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby Hannes_F » Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:56 am

RJHollins wrote:Ah ... you have BIDULE ... I'll be glad to share the preset chain. Which NVC controller would you prefer to see it with?


The Mammoth if you don't mind.

I have it now running halfway conventionally. These are the remaining problems:

- It seems not possible to assign fixed midi channels to a Nebula instance. Nebula wants to return to channel 16 all the time here. Therefore I tend to set the output channel of the Bus_Router instances to 16 too.

- The Nebula GUI does not refresh automatically (minor problem).

- So far the BW and Boost values work fine while the frequency hiccups.

I close my shop for today, talk later.
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby RJHollins » Tue Mar 25, 2014 6:47 am

Hannes_F wrote:The Mammoth if you don't mind.

I have it now running halfway conventionally. These are the remaining problems:

- It seems not possible to assign fixed midi channels to a Nebula instance. Nebula wants to return to channel 16 all the time here. Therefore I tend to set the output channel of the Bus_Router instances to 16 too.

- The Nebula GUI does not refresh automatically (minor problem).

- So far the BW and Boost values work fine while the frequency hiccups.

I close my shop for today, talk later.

The crux of the Nebula MIDI issue ! :twisted:

This is a highly requested change to be asked for with Nebula. The current mode is OMNI, which means, Nebula responds to every MIDI channel, at all times. This affects not only the NVC ... but any attempt via DAW, MIDI stream, what have you ... we do not have a way to 'speak' to a single Nebula directly ... we have to isolate each Nebula with a filter.

Taking the podium once again ... NEBULA COMMUNITY ... as nicely as you can ... please continue to request improved MIDI support with Nebula. :!: :mrgreen:

This can be done all within the Reaper chain as shown in the video on this. It is not really complicated as it seems at first glance. There is a definite, repeatable pattern used to address each Nebula. Once this is seen completely, its like ... yeah ... ok, that makes sense.

As for the BIDULE chain. I'll look to post here or at my site.

For BIDULE, I have a special chain and wiring that is working great. But this is my configuration, and I'm using tools that I prefer. There is no reason for anyone to be locked into what I'm using.

The big question is ... what happens in BIDULE if you don't have the plugs I use ... or what if the names of the plugs are different. What happens :?: This I do not know ... not the end of the world, but we may have to 'hand adjust' the plugins and their connections. Hey ... let's try it and see what we need to do.

Just a heads up ... this is what I have in my BIDULE chain. It is made from components included with BIDULE, along with 'my stuff' :lol:

1. Two main BIDULE modules. One is Audio, the other is MIDI.

2. I use the 'DUMMY' plugins to help keep the wiring organized.

3. my custom NEBULA built from Zab's SetUPs app. I've named the DLL something I can remember.

VERY IMPORTANT !

BIDULE needs to scan for new VST's. Strange as it might be, BIDULE actually uses the special VST plugin identifier number [magic number] to identify and acknowledge the plugins. I think some DAWs also do this [Cubase?]. This is an easy fix ...

The main NEBULA XML file has an entry:
Code: Select all
<MAGIC> o010 </MAGIC>

each of the custom Nebula's share this same number.
We need to change this number to be unique for each custom NEBULA Library.

Leave the original Nebula XML as is ... but go to where you have your custom Neb's. Each one of those has an XML file. Open that XML file, and near the top is this <MAJIC> number.

So for <MAGIC> o010 </MAGIC>, I change the o010 to o011 , and the next is o012 , then o013 , o014, etc.

**** I'm showing this list of numbers ... but, to be clear, each custom Nebula needs its own special number ... you might be using 5 or 6 or 13 Nebulas of a particular library for your chain ... that is fine ... you only need the one custom NEBULA that you would use as normal ... just have it a unique 'majic' number. [just didn't want confusion here]. The NVC design does not need anything different than what you would normally do [well, except to be sure it has the correct MIDI numbers edited in] :roll:

This is the way to do this according to Neb Tech.

BTW ... if you had already edited the original XML with the [CC] data [20 - 27], then Zab's app will have included that in each of your custom XML files.
If you didn't ... then you need this data in there.

Now when you tell BIDULE to scan for plugins, it will find all your custom ones too. :D

4. my MIDI CHANNEL FILTER/AudioRouter VST plugin. [FREE from my website]. This is an extremely simple looking plugin. There is 1 setting on it. :shock: Select the MIDI Channel you want. That MIDI output is then wired to the NEBULA MIDI Input.

Now ... That single Nebula can only respond to MIDI data on the channel selected. This must be set to the same channel on the NVC controller. Each sub-module of the NVC directs it's data down the MIDI channel selected. Just match them one for one.

Now ... the 'Audio Router' section.

The plugin has 4 outputs. [basically 2 stereo pairs].
One pair are for audio to go INTO Nebula. The other pair is to skip over Nebula [BYPASS], and gets wired to the next segment.

Remember ... each sub-module has a BYPASS button that allows taking a selected Nebula OUT of the audio chain. The AudioRouter is MIDI aware of the NVC's command and will switch the internal routing. [it also has some special 'ramping' feature that gently transition the bypass. NO MORE snap in the audio, nor overload LEDs on your DAW meters :D

Lastly ... I use the Klanghelm VU meters attached to each NEBULA in this chain. With its gain control, I use these to adjust each section back to 'unity'. The NVC has a 'CAL' module built in that makes this adjustment a breeze. The chain ends into BIDULE's 'mixer' module. That's it. ;)

I should probably repost a picture of this Bidule chain to show the wiring, AND the order of the plugins I've chosen.

I've gone through a couple variations, but this is where I'm at with the order. It looks very logical as to signal flow.

Again ... this is just the way I'm doing things. There is more than one way to 'patch a bay' :lol:
Then we look at serial or parallel processing, sideband control ... lots of options and routing power.

This said ... I should probably do a video tut of this, but I hope this helps guide everyone. The added bonus is this all gets saved as a preset !

Another benefit of BIDULE ... the 'SWAP' plugin function. Once a nice chain is built, it is simple to swap out a different Nebula library and keep all the wiring in place. Very efficient.

So now, my Reaper chain consist of a

1. FreeG at the very top [perfect 1st plug to set level from the start].

2. the NVC of choice

3. BIDULE with matching library

4. an extra FreeG to check RMS/Peak

5 ... whatever else I need. There may be Consoles at the top and bottom for example ... it all depends on whats being done.

OK ... I'll pull some stuff together.

I really hope everyone gets to try this out for real.
It is really worth the initial effort.
8-)
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Re: NVC - Series - General News

Postby RJHollins » Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:56 am

Already then ...

We have a little BIDULE action for ya !

Just to give a sense of my wiring layout, I have a partial screenshot of my NVC-BXQ-BIDULE.
Bidule screenshot-2.jpg
NVC-BXQ-BIDULE


and then, here is a Bidule PRESET of my NVC-MAMMOTH [mini].
Bidule for NVC-Mammoth[mini]-1.rar
(31.88 KiB) Downloaded 101 times

Had to RAR it to post here.

Inside is the preset to load into BIDULE.
I'd be curious to hear how this preset behaves on a completely different system.

Be mindfull of my plugins included in this preset.

1. my custom Nebula with Mammoth library, with a unique 'majic' vst number.
2. Klanghelm's VU meter
3. MIDIChannelFilter/AudioRouter. This is available on my site [free utility VST].

If doing this in REAPER ... then you do NOT need any of the 'support' files [ReaControl, ReaRoute].

Let the testing begin ;)
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