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Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby CoolColJ » Sun Oct 07, 2012 4:48 pm

timp wrote:Of course nebula wins!! :lol:


Yeah, but not quite as fast though, attack time wise.
Hard to really squash the sound with Nebula compressors
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby CoolColJ » Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:56 am

This is what I mean

http://www.members.optushome.com.au/coolcolj3/Rayphlex/


The attack/release is still not fast enough to truly squash the sound. A lot of transients get through so you need to stick a limiter after it
The dial may say 0.05ms attack time, but I really don't think it is....

Stillwell Rocket is also uber fast!
I set Rocket to 100 microsecond attack time, 50ms release, and 12:1 compression ratio, over 20db of gain reduction.
Then set up the other compressors to get a similar sound.

Softube is pretty fast hence why it sounds the way it does. Reminds me of my F*******e Compounder, that opto squash sound.

Only Vertigo VSC-2 came close, since it's a dual VCA style compressor, you can get it loud, and no transients sneak through.
Softube CL1B is opto style compressor so it's a bit slower. A limiter after it can help.

Rayphlex like all Nebula compressors always fail this test :(
So I just use Rocket and put Rayphlex after it for tone and 3D...
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby Cupwise » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:10 am

you use instant attacks for compression that regularly that you need it all the time? seems kind of extreme to me. the hardware here is a compressor, not a limiter. but the programs can be used to some capacity as limiters. at least, from my personal experiments they could. have you tried adding in look-ahead?
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby CoolColJ » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:26 am

Cupwise wrote:you use instant attacks for compression that regularly that you need it all the time? seems kind of extreme to me. the hardware here is a compressor, not a limiter. but the programs can be used to some capacity as limiters. at least, from my personal experiments they could. have you tried adding in look-ahead?


Where do I set that?

I use compression for effect quite a lot.
Even my cheap F*******e Compunder hardware unit can squash it in a similar way and it's not super fast. Fastest attack time is 0.1, or 1ms.
Not unlike a 1176 in effect I guess.

See here - I did not set it's attack time to the fastest setting either
http://www.members.optushome.com.au/coo ... ompounder/

I have tried to make any Nebula compressor do what my Compounder does, but none can :(
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby Cupwise » Mon Oct 08, 2012 4:52 am

check the tips section of the manual to see about look-ahead. it might help you get closer to what you want.
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby CoolColJ » Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:35 pm

Cupwise wrote:check the tips section of the manual to see about look-ahead. it might help you get closer to what you want.


Thanks, but it's not just the attack but having the sound "slam" in your face with a fast release as well

So I just think something is still not working right in Nebula IMO, as far as compression goes.

It should at the least be able to do what the Softube CL1B can do, which is an opto modelled compressor.
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby SWAN » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:44 pm

yes you are correct...

I suppose there is an assumption that it is understood that Nebula cannot capture every aspect of analogue compression at this time. However if you do not know this aspect - then its understandable to make a point of it.

Its due to the engine...I replied on also GS...theres no point in suggesting it 'should' be able to do something an algo compressor can do (never mind its a program from a different compressor design)...or a low end compressor...(which I also have in my collection)....pointless because Nebula uses a novel technology that is different from the others...so really - Nebula 'shouldnt' be able to do those type of compression - because it is impossible.

I can tell its an important aspect of compression for you very heavy smashing - but I think a lot of people generally only use compression in more typical moderate ways...and it is proving to be preferable to algo compressors in that respect in my experience...

Nebula can do what it can do - and the clever developers are getting some pretty great results within its limitations. But it cant be used for everything...
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby Cupwise » Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:04 pm

yeah, i think that the main limitation is with bass heavy stuff and fast releases.
you get aliasing artifacts if you try to use a release that's too fast on something with lots of bass, and with deep compression. to be fair, the units only go down to .04sec, and the settings below that were added in by me. not every compressor out there is going to have super fast, almost instant release times. and it's generally known that fast release times with bass is going to cause distortion or other bad results, with many comps.
but yes the results that happen in nebula because of it are different from what would happen with hardware. anyway, i tried to see how close i could get to your example (i processed the original with rayphlex):
http://www.cupwise.com/1.mp3
http://www.cupwise.com/2.mp3
http://www.cupwise.com/3.mp3
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby CoolColJ » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:39 am

Not bad.

Is the community version much different from the full version?
I noticed, that the community version was sitting at -7db or so, with 0db threshold, and the gain reduction meter was flickering. I needed to use the gain makeup to bring it back to unity gain
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Re: Rayphlex 661x2 A ( new demo prog added, set updated)

Postby Cupwise » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:51 am

yeah, the community version is 'stuck' at whatever ratio setting it has (i think it's 10:1 ?). but uhh, i wouldn't have expected you to get that much compression with the thresh at 0, because in the full version you wouldn't. you can set thresh at 0 and raise the ratio all the way up to 30:1 and your in/out levels should/would still match fairly closely (with full version). maybe i didn't calibrate the thresh control with the community version (maybe i forgot to, but i thought i had). i suppose i could check that out when i get time.


----
also, to get those results i got in those clips, i used the 1k version of the hard knee comp. i've noticed that the 1k versions seem better for squashing stuff. the attacks can be faster. 1k versions + look-ahead can give limiting, but like i said, the main weakness after that becomes fast release times + bass.
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