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Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

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Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby vicnestE » Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:11 pm

I did a little test to see how the nebula guitar cab simulation from Ownhammer react to input volume changes.

The capability of capturing different output frequency curves based on input volume is well-known in console and preamp nebula programs.

But I am quite shocked seeing that the frequency curves of Ownhammer library stay the same at different input volumes. I could see more harmonics in VSTAnalyser when the input volume is louder, but I doubt that why there's no slight changes in the EQ curve relating the input volume. We all know that Impulse Response when used in cab simulation is a static EQ curve with no pre-delay. And it is quite common to expect a nebula version would at least provide dynamic sound reacting based on playing level.

Attachment 1 is the frequency chart of "OwnHammer MesaV31 SM57 5" 0 position V.S. -6 input +6 input.
OwnHammer MesaV31 SM57 5 compare.png
Ownhammer Frequency Chart
OwnHammer MesaV31 SM57 5 compare.png (88.27 KiB) Viewed 1810 times

Attachment 2 is one of the early development of guitar cab simulation by AE (free).
0 position V.S. -6input +6input.
AE Roosevelt C414-2.png
AE Freuqnecy Chart
AE Roosevelt C414-2.png (175.47 KiB) Viewed 1810 times

Attachment 2 has the sensible frequency change related to input volume. AE is not a professional engineering, so the harsh highs are quite annoying.

I wish nebula would be the ultimate guitar cab simuation technology that we guitarists wait for so long. I bought a few Ownhammer's nebula cab programs and hestitate to buy more because I've got tons of static guitar cab IR and great nebula preamps with beautiful harmonics.


Anybody has ideas?
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Re: Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby Formbank » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:55 pm

I'm not entirely sure if I 'm getting your point correctly, but I wouldn't expect a guitar amp / speaker combo to have a changing frequency response depending on input level - apart from turning the volume control down on the guitar.

I think the Ownhammer nebula cab libraries are the best sounding 'digital cabs' I've come across. I'm not a collector, so I don't have all the libraries, but the ones I have I use all the time. They're invaluable for me.
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Re: Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby ownhammer » Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:23 pm

As stated in the site's F.A.Q. and in the information text file found within the library's folder structure, frequency response changes from varying input volume is close to negligible in some speakers, typically those with higher power handling capabilities, and very noticeable in other speakers, typically where the power handling is lower.
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Try this with the Alnico Blue, and you'll hear a difference.
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However, Formbank's point is valid; the change in relative frequency response over varying volume ranges is unrelated and irrelevant to overall sound quality of the programs, and the clarity provided by the format. Comparing a capture in NEB format to it's WAV equivalient, the WAV IR will add a little bit of 'mud and crud' that will inevitably stack in a multi-track mix, regardless of whether or not the frequency response changes over unrealistic volume variances. Thus the more appropriate question is - do you like the way they sound in how they fit with your other equipment with regard to the overall tonality you're trying to achieve? There is no right or wrong, good or bad answer to this question; at a certain quality, tone is subjective preference.
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FWIW, the volume changes in the capture procedure go from being able to rattle things on a shelf to being barely able to hear them in an adjacent room with the door open. If there is a frequency response change in another's programs using the same equipment, then it could be that they had the cab cranked so loud they were pushing the speakers into failure, which despite what you may think, sounds TERRIBLE. Possibly why there would be excessive high end. Another possibility is that their power amp feeding the cab changed in tonality depending on the volume being pushed out. If it were a tube amp, very realistic to propose, I'd say. All of this is assumption though, I can only speak from my experiences! :)
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Hope this helps!
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Re: Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby vicnestE » Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:59 pm

Thanks for your answer! But I don't have a Alnico Blue program yet.

So with solid state poweramp, the frequency response changes due to volume is very subtle.

These cab sim porgrams would be nice for guitar preamp simulations with poweramp simulation such as Lepou's Recto and onqel's upcoming TSE50 (with different tube possibillity).

It's good to know the nebula version sounds better than the wav IR version because I don't want to waste my money. :lol:

Also could you confirm that some kind of HPF is used in your post chain to reduce uncessary lows which sounds great alone but may be too much for mixing?
I tend to bring back some lows with other EQ for my taste.

I remember I've seen info and sound charaterstics of new cabs on your newsletters but I can't find the same info on the website.

The reason I did the VSTanalyser thing is I want to know why the sound of nebula cabs are more vivid and closer to real cabs when compared with static IRs.

I got great result using RH-theater of life as send fx (room sound). I believe once you release the room mics, the whole libraries will be greater.
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Re: Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby ownhammer » Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:22 pm

Thanks for your answer! But I don't have a Alnico Blue program yet.

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Quite welcome! Only one solution to that problem! :lol: :mrgreen:
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These cab sim porgrams would be nice for guitar preamp simulations with poweramp simulation such as Lepou's Recto and onqel's upcoming TSE50 (with different tube possibillity).

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FWIW, eventually, no idea when nor do I have any estimation, I'll be attempting to sample the power section of a couple of amps I have. Right now it's just something I plan to work on, the end result will be limited, and experimental, but also free. This wouldn't be particularly useful for people using sims like the ones you mentioned or heads with the poweramp already in them, but I figured I'd comment on it nonetheless. :)
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Also could you confirm that some kind of HPF is used in your post chain to reduce uncessary lows which sounds great alone but may be too much for mixing?
I tend to bring back some lows with other EQ for my taste.

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Sure thing, covered in F.A.Q. Q/A #5:
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http://www.ownhammer.com/support/faq/speakercabinets/
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I also make it a point in my capture procedure to reduce proximity effect but without becoming thin.
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I believe once you release the room mics, the whole libraries will be greater.

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These are going to be quite a ways out, but yes, I and many others I've spoken to are quite looking forward to them. :D
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Re: Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby vicnestE » Wed Apr 20, 2011 5:42 am

I'd love to try out the poweramp programs because I have good hardware guitar preamps.
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Re: Ownhammer Guitar Cab Simulation Question

Postby marcpl » Wed Apr 20, 2011 8:39 pm

don't want to hijack but i've purchased several of the ownhammer programs over the past few weeks and they are really excellent. very well done.

p.s.: i'd also be very interested in trying out any other programs that you've done so please keep us in the loop.

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