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Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby Mercado_Negro » Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:51 am

elam wrote:I was waiting for you to chime in hombre. ;) I was ready to post on Reaper forum about "freezing item" option as some people talk about it a little while ago when Justin bring the "freeze tracks" on the table.


I think it was schwa who worked on it :)


@RJHollins:

This is how I work:

Once I've set up all my levels (gain staging), I start adding Nebula instances per track and I work on 2 or 3 tracks at once (my computer can't handle more than that). Preamp+Tape+Boost+Console per track (sometimes it's just Tape+Console, etc.). OK, now once I get the sound I want from those tracks I freeze them. If I want to keep the console instance I just set it to offline state before freezing so REAPER won't take it into account in the freezing. Once I've frozen that track I just set that instance back to online state and continue my work. Freezing in REAPER doesn't work like other programs where frozen tracks aren't editable/modifiable. In REAPER, if you freeze a track you can unlock the new rendered file and edit it. You can offline FXs that you don't want to be present in the freeze and then set them online again and continue your work. You can freeze all your equalization and then freeze your compression, for example. You can go all the way back to your original state and REAPER will maintain your FXs (it doesn't keep your item edits, though). So, in conclusion, you can freeze as many times as you like and always come back to your previous/original state. REAPER will recall your "frozen" FXs and will put them there in their place in the chain again (you need to be careful with this, if you unfreeze a track all nebula instances will come back and that may collapse your CPU/RAM).

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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby RJHollins » Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:10 am

... and he's back ... with MORE questions :?

OK ... call me 'old-school', but seaching through the REAPER manual, and can't seem to find ...

I would like to set 'EFFECTS' on a track to be 'PRE-FADER'.

What I found when 'freezing' a track with 2 efx on it ... 1. TRIM, and 2. Nebula Console.

I had my track fader at a -12 starting point ... remember ... old-school ;) , we could set all console faders to move to a -12dB starting point before mixing. This allowed us to comfortably push selected tracks while having a 'bed reference' going and NOT have concern with VU meters. This also was tied into our reference 'listening' level.

OK ... the problem ... when I froze the track, the track fader was ALSO being involved. Me No Want That.

Again ... this is to render out the initial trim levels, Console, and maybe tape, as a type of track preparation prior to actual mixing.

What/ Where is the setting in REAPER to do this?

Thanks

heading back to manual reading.
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby Mercado_Negro » Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:41 am

RJHollins wrote:... and he's back ... with MORE questions :?

OK ... call me 'old-school', but seaching through the REAPER manual, and can't seem to find ...

I would like to set 'EFFECTS' on a track to be 'PRE-FADER'.

What I found when 'freezing' a track with 2 efx on it ... 1. TRIM, and 2. Nebula Console.

I had my track fader at a -12 starting point ... remember ... old-school ;) , we could set all console faders to move to a -12dB starting point before mixing. This allowed us to comfortably push selected tracks while having a 'bed reference' going and NOT have concern with VU meters. This also was tied into our reference 'listening' level.

OK ... the problem ... when I froze the track, the track fader was ALSO being involved. Me No Want That.

Again ... this is to render out the initial trim levels, Console, and maybe tape, as a type of track preparation prior to actual mixing.

What/ Where is the setting in REAPER to do this?

Thanks

heading back to manual reading.



Mixer inserts are always pre-fader in REAPER. There aren't post-fader slots. I think I don't understand something in your explanation: Why do you mention these 2 plug-ins if you're worried about track faders? I don't understand. You say you have a "trim plug-in" in your chain, what does this "trim plug-in" do? What do you use it for? When you say "track fader" are you talking about this "trim plug-in" fader or actual track faders? In any case, Freeze is always pre-fader. It doesn't matter if your track faders are at -12dB or not, this won't be applied to your rendered item. Please notice that we have "freeze" and "render as stems". The latter has two modes: pre-fader or post-fader. What are you really using?
i7 3770k :: Asus P8H77-V LE :: 16Gb DDR3 @1600MHz :: Geforce GT 520 :: OCZ-Vertex 128Gb :: WD Black Series 1Tb and Green Series 1Tb :: F*******e Liquid56 :: REAPER 64bit and StudioOne 64bit (both latest versions) :: Win 10 64bit
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby RJHollins » Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:52 am

hmmm ... this is the problem.

Just tried to freeze a track using the EFX page, selecting the effect I want the freeze to only use 'up to the last selected efx' ... If I pull the 'main track fader' all the way down ... the freeze level shows NO vu activity !
If I return the tracks fader back to say, 0 vu, NOW I hace audio showing in the freeze meters ...

ok, to clarify ...

The 1st efx is the Reaper TRIM modual. Since the track recorded level is NOT where I want, I use this to adjust this level to peak at -6dB. This then goes to a Nebula console plug.

Now, I have some addition plugs on this track that I DON'T want to include in this initial freeze ... stuff like compressors, etc.

Therefore I was using the effects window to select the place in the efx list that I want included in the freeze ... BUT, it seems to be tied to THAT tracks mixing fader.

Hope that made sense!
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby Mercado_Negro » Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:56 am

Freeze level? Freeze meters? Where are those? Man, I don't get it, please show me an screenshot or something. Look, here it is what I'm trying to explain:

Image

As you can see it doesn't matter if I pull the fader all the way down or up, it's still the same audio level in the rendered item.
i7 3770k :: Asus P8H77-V LE :: 16Gb DDR3 @1600MHz :: Geforce GT 520 :: OCZ-Vertex 128Gb :: WD Black Series 1Tb and Green Series 1Tb :: F*******e Liquid56 :: REAPER 64bit and StudioOne 64bit (both latest versions) :: Win 10 64bit
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby RJHollins » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:16 pm

ok ... I think I see what's happening.

If the track fader is UP ... when you go to freeze the track, the VU meter running during the freeze shows the moving level. On my system, freeze is running @ about 5x normqal speed.

NOW, If you take the same track fader and pull it ALL the DOWN. Do the same freeze ... there is NOTHING showing during the freezing on those same VUs.

This give the impression that the track is being frozen as SILENCE.

I now see that, 'What you SEE is NOT what you get'. :roll:

Sorry for making this confusing ... but ... this is very misleading, or unless I'm missing a fundamental here ... this is incorrect, or a gui bug :o

Whatever it is ... it threw me for a curve :?

THANKS for hanging with me Mercado !

BTW ... how did you do the moving graphic you posted ?
There are times when actually seeing something is better than a written description ... especially when the writer is confused :lol:

Again ... Thanks!!!!!
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby Mplay » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:58 pm

Very usefull info, thanks for sharing. The animated gifs are probably made with licecap.
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby elam » Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:32 pm

Mercado_Negro wrote:I think it was schwa who worked on it :)


I though Schwa and Justin was the same person.(not a big deal ;) ).

@ RJHollins One thing who helps too is to start to use "Reaper's terminology" (every DAW got its own).So you and Reaper's elders can be on the same page.

TCP,MCP,etc... That was, and still is,hard for me.But that's the way to go if you wanna build your own actions in the future ...(As you will need to find what you got in your head an translate it in "Reaper's language")
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby Mercado_Negro » Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:14 pm

RJHollins wrote:If the track fader is UP ... when you go to freeze the track, the VU meter running during the freeze shows the moving level. On my system, freeze is running @ about 5x normqal speed.

NOW, If you take the same track fader and pull it ALL the DOWN. Do the same freeze ... there is NOTHING showing during the freezing on those same VUs.

This give the impression that the track is being frozen as SILENCE.

I now see that, 'What you SEE is NOT what you get'. :roll:

Sorry for making this confusing ... but ... this is very misleading, or unless I'm missing a fundamental here ... this is incorrect, or a gui bug :o


This metering is what's coming out of the Master Track. REAPER can't use each track metering because then what will it show when you're freezing/rendering several tracks at once? It's the final output what's being showed there.

RJHollins wrote:BTW ... how did you do the moving graphic you posted ?
There are times when actually seeing something is better than a written description ... especially when the writer is confused :lol:

Again ... Thanks!!!!!


LICEcap, yeah. It's an little application developed by Justin. You can grab it from the same place where REAPER pre-release versions are.
i7 3770k :: Asus P8H77-V LE :: 16Gb DDR3 @1600MHz :: Geforce GT 520 :: OCZ-Vertex 128Gb :: WD Black Series 1Tb and Green Series 1Tb :: F*******e Liquid56 :: REAPER 64bit and StudioOne 64bit (both latest versions) :: Win 10 64bit
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Re: Calling all REAPER/Nebula experts

Postby richie43 » Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:33 pm

Call me crazy, but I still prefer to batch process my Nebula stuff. It works quite well. And since I have a copy of the project safely tucked away, if I ever need to revert a track back to it's original state, I copy/paste the file into the project folder and voila, it's back to it's original state. Mind you, this is mostly with the major instances, like the huge CPU killer chains that I do pre-mix, like Mercado said. These are the complete tube-console input-tape-tape booster (maybe x2)-console output. More detailed fx are done in the more typical way described by others; freezing/rendering stems. On that note, I syill render stems, I haven't seen the advantage to use the actual "freeze" action. How is it any better?
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