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2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

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2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby mitch » Thu Apr 07, 2011 1:38 pm

Hi!
I am a sound engineer 8-) , not a computer tech :geek: so I'd like to ask some questions:
I want to:
-be able to have a good amount of processing power
-have a system which loads pre-sets fast enough

So I decided to have a second machine in my studio which would be a kind of effect rack besides my daw machine(somehow like in the analogue way).


My questions:
1)what hard ware:
Should I go for the fastest processor available by Intel (i7 I believe) or is there any compatibility issue with this one?
Is there anything better/faster?
Is it right that I should add as much memory as possible?

2)which OS:
To have a good nebula machine, should I choose preferably W7-32bits, W764bits, xp sp3?
I think there is a difference in the ability of the 32bits version to use all of the memory beyond 4GB, right?

3)audio inter-connection: I am regarding forward to use an adat connection between the two machines.
Is there any easy and stable way (I AM NOT A COMPUTER TECH! ;) )to do so with an asio related Rj45 server inter-connection?
Or is it possible to do so with a firewire inter-connection?
Is there a bandwidth issue if I do so?

4)which daw:for this task I need a host daw for Nebula that tells me exactly the latency it has, and that is light enough to let Nebula use as much CPU of the computer as possible.
Saw studio or reaper are interesting!
Any thoughts?

5)latency: Except the buffer settings, is there a setting that could help keeping latency low, while the performance is high?

Thank you and best regards, sound fanatics!

Mitch
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby enriquesilveti » Thu Apr 07, 2011 7:31 pm

I want to:
-be able to have a good amount of processing power
-have a system which loads pre-sets fast enough


Hello Mitch. Buy a nuclear PC or MAC with SSD and a lot of RAM.

So I decided to have a second machine in my studio which would be a kind of effect rack besides my daw machine(somehow like in the analogue way).


Welcome LAN guy.

1)what hard ware:
Should I go for the fastest processor available by Intel (i7 I believe) or is there any compatibility issue with this one?


No one.

Is there anything better/faster?
Is it right that I should add as much memory as possible?


Buy a nuclear PC or MAC with SSD. And a lot of RAM.

2)which OS:
To have a good nebula machine, should I choose preferably W7-32bits, W764bits, xp sp3?
I think there is a difference in the ability of the 32bits version to use all of the memory beyond 4GB, right?


Any at x64, W7 x64 or OSX x64. I think you could run a linux and virtualize OSX but should be to complex.

3)audio inter-connection: I am regarding forward to use an adat connection between the two machines.
Is there any easy and stable way (I AM NOT A COMPUTER TECH! ;) )to do so with an asio related Rj45 server inter-connection?
Or is it possible to do so with a firewire inter-connection?
Is there a bandwidth issue if I do so?


Newest main boards have 2 Giga LAN NIC use one NIC to interconnect plugin server with client DAW with CAT6 cables.

4)which daw:for this task I need a host daw for Nebula that tells me exactly the latency it has, and that is light enough to let Nebula use as much CPU of the computer as possible.
Saw studio or reaper are interesting!
Any thoughts?


We use Samplitude 11 PRO and Pro Tools. Nebula work here without problems we didn't test server in PT yet.

5)latency: Except the buffer settings, is there a setting that could help keeping latency low, while the performance is high?


Decrease AHEADLENGTH
AHEADLENGTH: This parameter controls the look-ahead buffer used by compressor and dynamic emulation programs in general. It is expressed in milliseconds. Increasing this parameter will increase latency.
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby mitch » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:57 am

Hello Enrique, thank you for your reply!!
Hi everyone!

I have a few questions to add to make things more precise to me:

-a machine with as much ability to run Nebula as possible:
Hello Mitch. Buy a nuclear PC or MAC with SSD and a lot of RAM.
What is a ''nuclear PC''? Does it mean the fastest Pc
I can find will do the job, what ever particular processing chip is inside, i7 or not?

what OS for the Nebula machine:
Any at x64, W7 x64 or OSX x64.
Why is that? what is the reason why 64 is better?
Ability to use more memory?
Fastest communication busses inside the machine?

audio inter-connection between the machines:
Newest main boards have 2 Giga LAN NIC use one NIC to interconnect plugin server with client DAW with CAT6 cables.
That is really exciting, but could you explain this further, please?
How could I make this particular kind of setup to exist in my both machines?
Is there a driver for that? Is it asio related?

This is a really exciting technology, I can't wait to use it! :P
Thank you for your help,

Mitch
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby enriquesilveti » Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:19 pm

What is a ''nuclear PC''? Does it mean the fastest Pc


YES. Is a Acustica Audio well know joke. Try to buy a fast PC, for example an intel i7.

Why is that? what is the reason why 64 is better?
Ability to use more memory? Fastest communication busses inside the machine?


Nebula is a signal modelling processor so need to load samples (kernels) into RAM. x64 OS can handle more RAM than x86 OS.
That is really exciting, but could you explain this further, please? How could I make this particular kind of setup to exist in my both machines?
Is there a driver for that? Is it asio related?


No ASIO driver into server, No audio interface into the server, audio interfaces will be a LAN interface in the near future (for example Yamaha release a Waves plug-in LAN server for M7 live console last month). You just need a common LAN connection, better if is direct with CAT6 cable and GigaLAN NICs. You install Nebula3PRO + Server into both machines and setup both to use the correct IP address.

I'll release some LAN basic help ASAP
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby david1103 » Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:02 pm

if i were you i would either built or get someone who knows what they are doing to build you a PC with:


- latest intel i7 CPU and sandybridge based ASUS motherboard
- Vertex 3 SSD drive (maybe not quite out, worth waiting for!):


http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/27/oczs ... e-sf-228/#


- nice quality low noise case
- PSU with no fan and high efficiency
- 4 Gig RAM or maybe more
- Windows 7 64bit


if you want a soundcard, i like the echo firefire audiofire soundcards and have an audiofire 4. my friend has an audiofire 2 which he likes too.


i use cubase and it's excellent. everyone will tell you their DAW is best, you can try Reaper for free as long as you like:


http://reaper.fm/


have fun!
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby yr » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:02 pm

If you go for a firewire based sound-card you should probably look for a mother-board with a TI firewire controller. I'm not sure about Asus, but the new ASRock mother-boards are using a via controller which can be problematic.
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby mitch » Sat Apr 09, 2011 11:33 am

hello, thank you for the answers! ;)

About the computer, I think I have now a very good idea of what to choose for building it!

About the daw, you're definitely right david1103 to say that every one will say it's own daw is the best! :lol:

Thank you also for the sound cards ideas, but I think that if I can make the server work together with my daw through CAT6, it will be perfect for my needs.
(I already have a sound card in my daw computer...

Now a question about the server system :?: :

Enrique wrote:

''No ASIO driver into server, No audio interface into the server, audio interfaces will be a LAN interface in the near future (for example Yamaha release a Waves plug-in LAN server for M7 live console last month). You just need a common LAN connection, better if is direct with CAT6 cable and GigaLAN NICs. You install Nebula3PRO + Server into both machines and setup both to use the correct IP address.''

-If my daw machine is an xp computer, is it a problem for doing interconnection in a ''server way''?

-control of the Nebula effects:
Once Nebula 3PRO + server is installed in both machines, how does my daw see Nebula:
does it see it like a vst plugin which communicates with the other machine (sever)?
Will I edit the Nebula instances calculated in the server through a screen connected to the sever, or through a vst instance in my daw?

-latency: as the sound which goes to the server and comes back will add latency, does the Nebula instance in my daw machine tell my daw how long is the variable delay for each instances so my daw can take care of it? (like with a usual vst plug in?)
That would be great! :D

Best regards

Mitch
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby giancarlo » Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:15 pm

nebula sees a particular server (you can run many on many machine) just addressing an ip address and a port (so more servers are possible on the same pc or mac). You can connect mac osx and windows computers togheter too. Than you create as many "nebulas" (just copy and rename both the dll and the xml) as you want, each one configured to work with a specific server. In this way you can mix localservers, server on different computers. If you want to use the power of computer A you just run your nebulas configured to work with A, than if you need computer B you add instances configured to work with B and so on.

Nebula should be configured MANUALLY as usual. You just open the nebula.xml using notepad or a text editor and you tune SERVERADDRESS and SERVERPORT. It's possible we'll make these parameters available from a particular interface, anyway at the moment I don't like overcomplicated things, we are advertising a localserver nebula which works automatically in local mode, without tuning anything. This is what we released officially. PLUS, you can use it in your TCP network, but it's up to you. This part is not advertised infact. I think tools created by franci zab could be tweaked for this exact purpose (tuning internet addresses), just ask him to add this server configuration feature to the existing code.

Latency of the network is NOT an issue since the only requirement is that it is covered by the actual nebula latency. If your network delay is greater simply nebula will start crackling, because samples are not ready. So you incraese your DSPBUFFER till you can manage it. On the daw side, if the DSPBUFFER is too much low the CPU load will raise suddenly (and so the ASIO meter of your DAW). If let's say you open too many instances on a particular internet cable the CPU will start spiking and you'll be forced to close instances, choose nebulas configured on a different cable, or in localserver mode, or simply standard nebula instances. Everything is easy and it's up to you. We provided a nebula3 free server version, so you are able to TEST your network before buying.

I repeat AGAIN. You can use nebula server for connecting togheter different computers, but this feature is NOT official, it's up to you. If you are not a tcp ip geek and you are simply a musician, WAIT because support at the moment is POOR. I don't want to teach guys to launch command tools, ipconfig and similar garbage. AT THE MOMENT NEBULA SERVER IS ADVERTISED FOR LOCAL USAGE ONLY, you click on the server BEFORE LAUNCHING your daw and it's ALL. OTHERWISE I'LL START PROVIDING SUPPORT BUT MY PRICE IS HIGH, AROUND 100 EUR/HOUR.
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby mitch » Sun Apr 10, 2011 12:39 pm

Thank you Giancarlo for this detailed explanation on the use of the server process with Nebula!
I think it will be a great help for me and probably for a lot of future server users to have these informations so we understand better what we are talking about. :D

You're right, I'm not a tcp/ip geek (at the moment).
As there are some basics that must be known to tune a server system that are not explained here for the moment, I'll get the help of a friend for that part. ;)

I see also that there is not one only way to build a system, and that several Nebula servers could be build inside the same computer, or across several different computers, no matter the OS system (mac, lynux or windows).
And I understand that working between several computers is not yet an OFFICIAL way of doing things, but that it can work great ;)

I am happy to see that latency is not an issue, as keeping tracks perfectly in synchrony is so essential!

Best regards,

Mitch
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Re: 2nd machine for more processing power with Nebula

Postby ToneVision » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:13 am

thanks!
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